Hook Type and Size

kyfisherman · Post by **kyfisherman** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 9:03 pm

For shark fishing from the surf and not yakking or floating your bait out. What size and type of hook would you use if you were using cut bait? For instance a blue runner head or something of that nature.

I am thinking circle hooks but we will see what the experts have to say.
not sure on size

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 12:19 pm

Circle hooks are the way to go. Use 10/0 or 11/0 Super Mutu's. 11/0's are better. You can't find a better hook than that one. If your using large heads or large chunks of fish, use 12/0 Super Mutu's.

Wat kind of gear do you have?

SHARKBOY · Post by **SHARKBOY** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 1:30 pm

haha go get some mustad 12/0s

circle hooks arent all that great friend lost a monster using one...

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 1:45 pm

SHARKBOY wrote:haha go get some mustad 12/0s

circle hooks arent all that great friend lost a monster using one...

Ya and I've lost about 50 monsters on J's. Wats your point? You can't catch them all. Circle hooks out perform J's when it comes to catching sharks. Especially when your targeting sharks like BT's and spinners that jump. I had probably close to 100 BT's spit the hook on me while jumping when I was using J's. I've only had 1 spit the hook on me while jumping using circle hooks. J's work better with Bulls and larger sharks that don't jump, but even then they can't beat a circle.
Frank Mundus, the pioneer of sharkin says to use circle hooks and he knows what he's talking about.

kyfisherman · Post by **kyfisherman** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 2:48 pm

yeah we can't base our findings on hooks on someone losing 1 shark.

as far as my gear i am on the light side and i know it.... But I'm just looking at it if I win ok if i lose no big deal.

I have a Penn 545GS spooled with 300 yds of power pro, and a big topshot of ande 40#. 50# class rod

Not a true shark rig but I think I can handle a lot of sharks but I am sure there are some that would destroy me haha.

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 3:09 pm

kyfisherman wrote:yeah we can't base our findings on hooks on someone losing 1 shark.

as far as my gear i am on the light side and i know it.... But I'm just looking at it if I win ok if i lose no big deal.

I have a Penn 545GS spooled with 300 yds of power pro, and a big topshot of ande 40#. 50# class rod

Not a true shark rig but I think I can handle a lot of sharks but I am sure there are some that would destroy me haha.

You need more than 300yds. Recently, my Daiwa grandwave almost got spooled, it was down to a couple yards, and it has 400 yards of 40lb PP. Your taking a chance with 300 yards. 500 yards is always a safe zone.

Now what kind of rod do u have and what length?

Your going to need a true shark rig. I used to use crap ones and those BT's and spinners destroyed them. I've had one BT blow out a 500lb BB swivel and my drag wasn't even that tight. Make your rigs at a minimum 350lb rated. I use 500lb rated rigs for my casting rigs and 1500lb rating for my yaking rigs.

Well your going to want to win, it sucks when you catch 1 in 8 and lose 6 setups and not to mention the cost $$$.

Sharks are serious critters, and you need serious tackle to catch them. I've had sharks blow up my drags on my reels and warp the gears inside my reels sevreal times.

My first law/rule of shark fishing is:
Cheap stuff just won't cut it.

Hope this helps.

kyfisherman · Post by **kyfisherman** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 3:42 pm

My reel probably does have 500 yrds of line on it, has 300 of power pro and probably at least 200 of mono.

Ohh sure if I was going to chase sharks all the time I wouldn't want this rig, but I've seen good sized sharks caught on much less ample gear. I only get to fish for 2 weeks a year in Florida and it is definitely not worth it to me to spend a lot on one particular rig.

Like I said, I feel I can handle descent sized sharks, I know the monster ones aren't for me. If they break me off, spool me, or whatever don't matter much to me.

You said a 500lb rig, I'm wondering how in the world you could ever put that much pressure on a fish. I mean 40lb test and a 500 lb shark rig. My reel will only put maybe 20# of pressure. I'm just curious what happens when a shark breaks a 350# rig. Let me know

SHARKBOY · Post by **SHARKBOY** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 3:54 pm

im not going for black tips ... i fish for the bigger... what is it that u fish with for ur sharks.... and by the way i dont think ull hook up as much on circles

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:53 pm

kyfisherman wrote:My reel probably does have 500 yrds of line on it, has 300 of power pro and probably at least 200 of mono.

Ohh sure if I was going to chase sharks all the time I wouldn't want this rig, but I've seen good sized sharks caught on much less ample gear. I only get to fish for 2 weeks a year in Florida and it is definitely not worth it to me to spend a lot on one particular rig.

Like I said, I feel I can handle descent sized sharks, I know the monster ones aren't for me. If they break me off, spool me, or whatever don't matter much to me.

You said a 500lb rig, I'm wondering how in the world you could ever put that much pressure on a fish. I mean 40lb test and a 500 lb shark rig. My reel will only put maybe 20# of pressure. I'm just curious what happens when a shark breaks a 350# rig. Let me know

You don't need a lot of pressure on the line for a shark to destroy swivels. Surfrat can explain that very well and you will see when he puts up his report in the next few days. It's all how the shark jumps and where the leader is at the time. The leader is where 90% of the stress is or higher. And the shark doesn't even have to jump to blow out swivels, a real good tug will do it. That's how my Penn drag blew up and how my gears got warped.

SHARKBOY, post up some pix of sharks you caught bigger than a 7ft BT.

kyfisherman · Post by **kyfisherman** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:06 pm

yeahhh i guess the big sharks have unreal power, hopefully I wont hook up on anything much over 6ft. as far as hooks i beleive circles are the way to go, they pretty much hook therselves and its generally in the corner of the mouth. I saw a report that is on this forum of a 116lb shark that frayed a 600lb steel leader pretty bad. I really don't understand how they do it but know they do.

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:14 pm

kyfisherman wrote:yeahhh i guess the big sharks have unreal power, hopefully I wont hook up on anything much over 6ft. as far as hooks i beleive circles are the way to go, they pretty much hook therselves and its generally in the corner of the mouth. I saw a report that is on this forum of a 116lb shark that frayed a 600lb steel leader pretty bad. I really don't understand how they do it but know they do.

Circles are a good choice. Owner Super Mutu's are the best. If your fishing for shark on the beach and there are sharks around, you will hook-up with a 6+ footer, guaranteed. Their teeth are remarkable, truly legendary of any fish. If they get that cable in between their teeth just right, well not even 1000lb cable can save you. I have numerous jaws in my room and the teeth are like wire cutters. I've taken teeth and cleanly cut a sheet of paper in half with no problem.

big_matt_duq · Post by **big_matt_duq** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:15 pm

this post seems to be heading for the same place so many have lately. im just waiting for another childish war between two individuals that are not mature enough to accept that their particular idea may not be always right or right for everyone.

"Your going to need a true shark rig. I used to use crap ones and those BT's and spinners destroyed them. I've had one BT blow out a 500lb BB swivel and my drag wasn't even that tight. Make your rigs at a minimum 350lb rated. I use 500lb rated rigs for my casting rigs and 1500lb rating for my yaking rigs. "

i agree with everything the 1500lb part. if your putting that much pressure on a fish your a big green man named the hulk! i would say your previous failure was from a defective swivel. at even 1000lbs of pressure your cable would break before that would happen. your talking a 1500lb swivel. there is no way that you can put that much pressure on a leader with any line. no offense bth but you dont look like that big of a dude and i would find it pretty hard for you to put that kind of force in the line. where do you get your swivels b/c the biggest snap swivels i can find are 500lb and then the spro heavy inlines go to 1320lbs. if you can pull apart a 500lb swivel with a rod and reel i will pat you on the back.

I AM NOT TRYING TO START A WAR OR BELITTLE ANYONE HERE, JUST THINK SOME OF YOUR INFO MAY BE A LITTLE EXAGERATED.

kyfisherman · Post by **kyfisherman** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:20 pm

I've seen pics of frayed cables that were 600lb plus. But i find it hard to imagine a shark being able to break a 1000lb swivel. The fish would have to wrap it around a reef or something, I mean there is only so much pressure that you can put on a vish via a rod.

I see what you guys are saying about the cables though, if a shark got that it in there just right it would be doomed.

Blacktip hunter you think it would be a common catch to go out and catch 6ft plus sharks off of hutchinson island???

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:38 pm

big_matt_duq wrote:this post seems to be heading for the same place so many have lately. im just waiting for another childish war between two individuals that are not mature enough to accept that their particular idea may not be always right or right for everyone.

"Your going to need a true shark rig. I used to use crap ones and those BT's and spinners destroyed them. I've had one BT blow out a 500lb BB swivel and my drag wasn't even that tight. Make your rigs at a minimum 350lb rated. I use 500lb rated rigs for my casting rigs and 1500lb rating for my yaking rigs. "

i agree with everything the 1500lb part. if your putting that much pressure on a fish your a big green man named the hulk! i would say your previous failure was from a defective swivel. at even 1000lbs of pressure your cable would break before that would happen. your talking a 1500lb swivel. there is no way that you can put that much pressure on a leader with any line. no offense bth but you dont look like that big of a dude and i would find it pretty hard for you to put that kind of force in the line. where do you get your swivels b/c the biggest snap swivels i can find are 500lb and then the spro heavy inlines go to 1320lbs. if you can pull apart a 500lb swivel with a rod and reel i will pat you on the back.

I AM NOT TRYING TO START A WAR OR BELITTLE ANYONE HERE, JUST THINK SOME OF YOUR INFO MAY BE A LITTLE EXAGERATED.

I never said anything about blowing out 1500lb swivels. I said 500lb swivels. I just said i put 1500lb swivels on my yaking rigs. And a 800-1000lb mako would blow out a 1500lb swivel if it jumped just right, no problem. I use 500lb snap swivels, i never said i used anything bigger. I've had more than 10 swivels blow up on me, and theres no way that they were all defects. If so im going to buy a lottery ticket tonight. Think about it, you have the weight of the shark landing on the leader, the resistance of the water, the pressure you have on the line including the pressure of the line cutting through the water. Add all that up and you get a wicked strong force. And there are probably other factors, like the shark twisting n other crap.

Here's the picture of my old rig that had the 500lb BB swivel on it. There are a 250lb split ring that got destroyed. the 5/0 3-way swivel that got ruined. The hook was completely done. These were my old rigs, back when i used J's and crappy designs.

the 500lb swivel is the one that is attached to the hook part, the welded eye got striaghtened.

Here's Surfrat's 300lb snap swivel and what's left of it:

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:43 pm

kyfisherman wrote: Blacktip hunter you think it would be a common catch to go out and catch 6ft plus sharks off of hutchinson island???

I have never fished there, so I wouldn't now, but on Juno 6+ footers are fairly common.

kyfisherman · Post by **kyfisherman** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:53 pm

yeah not far away though, maybe an hour north, i heard that in june a lot of spinners stacked up on hutchinson.

How is the shark fishing in general in June on the treasure coast?

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:59 pm

kyfisherman wrote:yeah not far away though, maybe an hour north, i heard that in june a lot of spinners stacked up on hutchinson.

How is the shark fishing in general in June on the treasure coast?

I've never fished Florida in June, so I wouldn't know lol. But I do know that there are a lot of nurses that come through and some bulls.

big_matt_duq · Post by **big_matt_duq** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 6:12 pm

bth there is one problem i see with what you are saying. the rig is only as strong as the weakest component used. the 250lb ring is weaker than the swivel so it should go first. i understand about mako's but how many have you landed from shore. the swivel that you have shown that the rings straightened does not look like it failed, just was mangled. as far as the forces involved, they certainly will add up when water is applied but i just dont know how much truth is in this arguement. maybe there is something happening that i am not understanding. braid also would play a major part since there is no stretch so more shock is placed on the terminal equipment. if you say you have blown that many swivels apart then i believe you but like in your pics, i would think the hooks or rings would go first since they are not one continuous piece of metal. a hook is just a bend of metal and so are the rings so there is nothing stoping them from straightening except the force needed to bend the metal. once again i am not here to trash talk you or any other member, just adding my oppinion an knowledge.

Blacktip Hunter · Post by **Blacktip Hunter** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 7:03 pm

big_matt_duq wrote:bth there is one problem i see with what you are saying. the rig is only as strong as the weakest component used. the 250lb ring is weaker than the swivel so it should go first. i understand about mako's but how many have you landed from shore. the swivel that you have shown that the rings straightened does not look like it failed, just was mangled. as far as the forces involved, they certainly will add up when water is applied but i just dont know how much truth is in this arguement. maybe there is something happening that i am not understanding. braid also would play a major part since there is no stretch so more shock is placed on the terminal equipment. if you say you have blown that many swivels apart then i believe you but like in your pics, i would think the hooks or rings would go first since they are not one continuous piece of metal. a hook is just a bend of metal and so are the rings so there is nothing stoping them from straightening except the force needed to bend the metal. once again i am not here to trash talk you or any other member, just adding my oppinion an knowledge.

Yes and that leader in my picture is my old crappy design, but if i would have taken a clear piture of the 500lb BB swivel you would understand. That entire leader was shot, except the 500lb BB snap swivel. I don't know why that didnt go.

Sean Paxton · Post by **Sean Paxton** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 10:02 pm

The picture of that 600 # stainless braid frayed up by a 116 lb spinner is the last one in the report in this link. Throw in whatever species of fish with whatever rod / reel configuration, then the leader and however many components that's made up of ... don't forget the knots, and then your angler and the bottom and other structure and it's pretty much anybody's game. It seems anything can happen to anyone with any fish. At least every encounter is a chance to learn.

Thanks for the info shared in this thread, and Happy Hunting,
Sean Paxton

http://www.fishinggonewild.com/html/exp ... ersen.html

kyfisherman · Post by **kyfisherman** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 10:12 pm

yeah sean that was amazing that shark did that to the leader, those teeth are something else..

those swivels and rings do look like they've had the lick. I may have someone to make me some shark rigs, its hard to find them the way I'd want in a store and if you do they are highhhh.

That 116 pound shark tore up that leader, but at the same time he's liable to reel in a 400 pound bull and not hurt the leader at all. Different situation everytime out I'd think.

Sean Paxton · Post by **Sean Paxton** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 10:17 pm

Yeah. No doubt. It's the different every time part that keeps us comin' back.

Stay Tight,
Sean

cudaman · Post by **cudaman** » Sun Jan 14, 2007 2:16 am

Yes, it is all about preference, I've always said I am not a professional nor wanna be, so here is my .02 cents..... what type of shark is that you are targetting is not always what you are gonna get! It is just nature if they are hungry you will hook them, period.....no matter what method u r using.... Many methods will work, Jhooks, circle hooks, IGFA, wait, my way will also work, and it will, it has. it will. It is a question of how an angler will do, it always is. Do you have a fair advantage? 200+ rod? 150+ line? There ya go....

Winch them and you are in conservaition!!! Sport them and you might kill them unless u r gonna eat them ( I know, if there is no chance, I will eat) Get the tags and help a little , info goes a long way.. it sure has since 1962....hells and heavens is just my .02 cents

By the way I do use 9/0 Jhook with my 6/0 rig and a 12/0 circle hook with my 9/0 rig it is just my preference..... We can all fish differently..... and be successfull about it...

Sean Paxton · Post by **Sean Paxton** » Sun Jan 14, 2007 12:37 pm

Surfrat,

Good to see you, and Happy New Year to all. I'll look forward to your report on the unusual BT experiences. It's interesting what you said about having what feels and looks like a hook up ending in a loss.

Last year, we fished a beach hard for four days straight. And had so many pickups and runs that resulted in the same way. On one of the last occasions, we allowed a fish to just pull steady for nearly 2 minutes with little to no drag. By this time, we were getting sick of the mystery meat so we took our time and a long walk while it steadily pulled line off a 9/0 with 50#. We could feel the weight of a nice fish and even head shakes. That bait was rigged with 12/0 J's so when we finally agreed enough time to eat had passed, we got aggressive and decided to start the fireworks show. Drag was slowly applied and the steel was put to 'em for extra measure then ... NOTHING!

Seems whatever it was only mouthed the bait the entire time. When inspected, a sizable shark definitely had it, but just enough to inflict some long, shallow lacerations and multiple punctures. The punctures looked like they were caused by the initial pickup and the lacerations resulted during the long, slow run. This would've been during the time we were certain he was eating, especially with the head shakes on light drag.

Gotta love it, either way. I'm not sure sometimes if it's episodes like this or when you flop something decent on the beach that keeps us coming back for more. Thanks again for the info.

And may the biggest of fish swim your way,
Sean

revenge · Post by **revenge** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 5:58 pm

Sean is wright. I fish w/ 30lb braid with 12' 80lb mono and 4' of # 7 or 9 wire. Pull 70lb-90 blacktips & spinners all the time but some times it just dose't work. Things do go wrong sometimes very bad! After all it is fishing not catching. I will say I have had great luck with circle hooks #10-#11 offset.